0.000000 3.040000 This is Trustworthy.
3.040000 6.040000 Hi, I'm Sarah, and I'm Mary Beth.
6.040000 9.280000 How do we build a trustworthy life
9.280000 12.080000 through the help of a trustworthy God?
12.080000 17.120000 Well, hello there, Mary Beth.
17.120000 18.960000 Hello, Sarah.
18.960000 22.080000 We've got some folks with us on Zoom today,
22.080000 25.400000 and they're not just anybody.
25.400000 26.600000 They're not just anybody.
26.600000 27.360000 No.
27.360000 30.040000 These are our most VIP guests so far, I would say.
30.040000 32.640000 Well, I would say that if it weren't for them,
32.640000 34.280000 you and I would not be here.
34.280000 36.440000 Accurate.
36.440000 38.600000 In the most literal sense of the word.
38.600000 39.920000 It's our dads.
39.920000 41.560000 It is.
41.560000 44.680000 We are excited to welcome both of our fathers
44.680000 49.160000 to our virtual Trustworthy studio today
49.160000 53.720000 to talk about Christ being the solid rock
53.720000 55.480000 on which we build our lives.
55.480000 57.840000 Well, let's let's introduce them.
57.840000 60.600000 OK, this is my dad, Hutch Hutchins.
60.600000 63.480000 I was explaining before we got on that.
63.480000 65.480000 Hutch is a nickname, his real name is Julian,
65.480000 68.880000 but how long did he have you gone by Hutch since college?
68.880000 70.320000 Is that when that started?
70.320000 71.680000 That's when it started.
71.680000 72.360000 Yep.
72.360000 75.400000 And he lives down in Georgia, where I'm from.
75.400000 80.320000 So it's good to see him virtually today.
80.320000 80.960000 Well, welcome.
80.960000 82.840000 We're glad to have you here.
82.840000 84.320000 Thank you.
84.320000 89.440000 And my father, Stephen Richard, is also with us.
89.440000 95.240000 He is a pastor and newly retired masonry professor,
95.240000 98.720000 although he has not retired from masonry just from teaching it.
98.720000 100.040000 Well, thank you, Sarah.
100.040000 103.280000 Yes, I will not retire from masonry.
103.280000 106.440000 Absolutely good point.
106.440000 110.520000 Building with masonry units like brick and block,
110.520000 117.880000 but especially stone really speaks to my soul, which is why
117.880000 122.080000 I called you and got some great information for the last episode,
122.080000 125.520000 our first episode of this season, in which we discussed how
125.520000 129.720000 Christ is a solid rock on which we build the foundation of our lives.
129.720000 135.000000 So we brought both of you here today, because not only did you
135.000000 137.640000 both come up in conversation on the first episode,
137.640000 142.440000 but the more we thought about it, we're like, wow, the reason
142.440000 146.720000 that we are who we are is because of the two of you.
146.720000 154.240000 And the fact that you both have chosen to build your life on Jesus
154.240000 159.960000 is given Mary Beth and I, I guess I would say, a stability
159.960000 163.720000 and sort of sure footing Mary Beth wouldn't you say?
163.720000 166.720000 Yeah, I mean, as we've been talking about this idea
166.720000 170.720000 of a firm foundation and anchoring that in Christ,
170.720000 174.240000 you and I've both been beneficiaries of the fact that our father's
174.240000 176.400000 built their families on that foundation.
176.400000 182.440000 And so we thought who better to talk more about it than those two guys.
182.440000 186.840000 Well, without any further ado, let's have them each give us
186.840000 191.600000 just a little elevator pitch in 60 seconds or so.
191.600000 192.520000 Introduce yourself.
192.520000 194.640000 Tell us a little bit more about yourself.
194.640000 196.160000 Hutch, you want to go first?
196.160000 201.920000 Sure, I grew up in Greensboro, Georgia, which is a small town
201.920000 208.000000 in North Georgia and went to a small high school, 65 people
208.000000 210.840000 in my senior class.
210.840000 217.160000 And after that to Emory at Oxford, then Emory University
217.160000 220.400000 to school and then to the Medical College of Georgia for med school.
220.400000 224.560000 So I then served in there for it for four years.
224.560000 229.840000 And as a flight surgeon, got to fly a little bit in the back seat
229.840000 231.400000 of a F4 during that time.
231.400000 235.200000 So that was an experience you don't get any other way.
235.200000 239.760000 And then after that, I did primary care for several years
239.760000 244.040000 and then sort of transitioned into doing emergency medicine,
244.040000 246.680000 which I did for about 30 years.
246.680000 253.360000 I've been retired from that for, well,
253.360000 257.040000 actually fiveto seven years, I guess, now.
257.040000 259.400000 And still trying to figure that part out.
259.400000 263.360000 So that's where I am now.
263.360000 266.520000 All right, dad, Stephen.
266.520000 267.520000 60 seconds.
267.520000 269.760000 Here it is.
269.760000 273.440000 Most of my growing up was in the suburbs of Philadelphia
273.440000 277.320000 on the edge of country woods and farms,
277.320000 282.200000 but right next to the outer edges of the city.
282.200000 285.720000 Opportunities to do a bunch of stuff.
285.720000 290.680000 I always hankered to be outdoors, back at the creek plan,
290.680000 295.320000 in the woods, fishing, trapping muskrats, anyway.
295.320000 300.320000 So I stumbled through high school, did enter college,
300.320000 303.560000 got a degree, five and a half years of college
303.560000 307.720000 of different majors to find out I wanted to be a brick layer.
307.720000 309.800000 So that's how I ended up.
309.800000 314.480000 Then my young wife and I, who both loves fishing and the outdoors,
314.480000 318.040000 decided to move to the mountains of Pennsylvania, upstate.
318.040000 321.560000 Upstate, they call it, when you live in Delaware County,
321.560000 323.560000 Pennsylvania.
323.560000 328.240000 And so we moved to Potter County and just started out.
328.240000 333.160000 Well, kind of poor and rough, but we were etching out
333.160000 335.480000 of living in an area where we didn't know anybody,
335.480000 337.360000 but we did get to know people.
337.360000 341.960000 So we look back and we see God's grace and the joy
341.960000 344.200000 of what God has given us.
344.200000 349.240000 Well, thank you for that.
349.240000 352.200000 Mary Beth, I'm going to pass it off to you
352.200000 354.240000 for our first question.
354.240000 355.680000 OK.
355.680000 361.960000 So our concept is crisis is first building block of discipleship.
361.960000 364.000000 That's what we're talking about this season on the show.
364.000000 368.440000 So if you could look back in your life, when do you first
368.440000 372.960000 remember knowing Christ as that solid rock?
372.960000 375.880000 Maybe you already knew him, but this concept of him
375.880000 379.320000 being the solid rock, your foundation?
379.320000 384.160000 When did that concept first kind of enter enter your life?
384.160000 386.680000 Stephen, let's start with you on this one.
386.680000 387.680000 Thank you.
387.680000 395.440000 Well, Christ the solid rock, very interesting.
395.440000 399.520000 I do have to say some things about this.
399.520000 402.920000 Jesus' contemporaries, except for Paul never addressed
402.920000 404.160000 him as a rock.
404.160000 406.840000 That was added in Apostle Paul's letters
406.840000 411.280000 and people used to describe him later
411.280000 413.280000 in the next generation of church.
413.280000 416.560000 But listen to this.
416.560000 422.280000 Let's go back old Testament times, several thousand years.
422.280000 426.640000 How does a group of people who are rescued from slavery
426.640000 431.240000 in Egypt through miracle after miracle after miracle?
431.240000 435.440000 How do they describe a God which cannot be seen?
435.440000 439.000000 But shows up in their life and never backs down, never
439.000000 442.480000 withhold this love, never withholds his provision.
442.480000 447.560000 Like what material, what physical material,
447.560000 449.840000 or geological material in the world
449.840000 455.160000 that iron age material, what is unchanging,
455.160000 461.080000 unmovable, immutable, and always present?
461.080000 464.240000 Well, it's a rock.
464.240000 470.040000 So they used rock to describe God.
470.520000 480.600000 And rightly so, we use rock to describe Jesus
480.600000 483.960000 because he is God.
483.960000 493.000000 But I'll finish up as a boy, as a teenager.
493.000000 499.080000 Jesus was the rock I would return to
499.080000 504.400000 when I made trouble for myself, so to speak.
504.400000 510.200000 I was not anchored.
510.200000 516.360000 So there's some food for thought.
516.360000 519.160000 All right, Daddy, what about you?
519.160000 524.080000 Well, I grew up in the church and went to Sunday school.
524.080000 529.400000 Every Sunday went to church every morning and night, home Sunday's.
529.400000 535.840000 And when I was about 10, we'd have a revival spring and fall.
535.840000 538.400000 So the preacher would come by to the 10-year-olds
538.400000 540.760000 and say, well, it's time to join the church.
540.760000 542.160000 So do, you want to join the church.
542.160000 547.320000 Now, I don't really recall him talking much about Christ.
547.320000 551.040000 But whatever he talked about, I remember my decision
551.040000 554.960000 or thinking at that point was, there's got to be more to this.
554.960000 559.120000 And so while the other three guys in my Sunday school class
559.120000 561.720000 did join the church that year, I did not.
561.720000 568.160000 And then a year from then, we had another revival on schedule.
568.160000 572.080000 And I did hear the gospel and responded
572.080000 577.400000 by trusting Christ as my Savior to forgive my sins
577.400000 581.160000 and was baptized and joined the church.
581.160000 590.720000 So after then, I always, I think, had that foundation of Christ
590.720000 593.960000 and my relationship with God.
593.960000 597.920000 But it was in college when I was involved in a campus crusade
597.920000 605.200000 for Christ ministry that first really got teaching that sort
605.200000 609.880000 of formed the foundations of my Christian life
609.880000 614.440000 and anybody else's too that would pay attention to it.
614.440000 621.000000 And so that's when I guess I was first sure of my relationship
621.000000 624.920000 with God and knew that I had trusted Him.
624.920000 632.280000 And I think from that point on, and to some extent, part of that,
632.280000 639.400000 I would be, I would trust God as the decision-making point
639.400000 641.960000 against which I judged everything I did.
641.960000 645.160000 And if there were challenges that came up,
645.160000 650.000000 then I would look to what God had said in His Word.
650.000000 652.280000 I'm a combination, an exhortive prophet.
652.280000 656.720000 And so I look back to the Word and see what it says.
656.720000 660.160000 And if it says it, then that's what I believe in.
660.160000 664.040000 So I look to see what God said and then try
664.040000 667.640000 to fit into what He said He wanted us to do.
667.640000 672.440000 Yeah, I like that Hutch.
672.440000 674.560000 How you just said, you know, you look back to the Word.
674.560000 677.920000 And I think Jesus is the Word of life too.
677.920000 679.400000 I mean, there's all these different ways
679.400000 680.560000 that He's usually described.
680.560000 687.000000 But the full revelation, the full story of God
687.000000 690.240000 that we find in the Bible and the way He shows up there
690.240000 693.240000 helps us know who Christ is.
693.240000 698.240000 I like the fact that Hutch didn't, in his term didn't
698.240000 701.280000 just go along with the other boys.
701.280000 705.840000 Sound like he was thinking things through.
705.840000 708.960000 That does not surprise me one bit.
708.960000 712.440000 I was going to say something along those lines.
712.440000 715.440000 I guess that'll do.
715.440000 716.640000 That's awesome.
716.640000 719.440000 I mean, if you're going to trust in God's Word,
719.440000 722.160000 and God's Word says one thing, and somebody else says another,
722.160000 727.680000 then you can't go along with whatever somebody else says
727.680000 730.760000 and be faithful to the Lord, I don't think.
730.760000 733.640000 So I tend to live that way.
733.640000 736.920000 And sometimes it gets you into a little bit of conflict.
736.920000 739.520000 But that's all right.
739.520000 743.080000 God can take care of his own Word and me too.
743.080000 744.200000 That's right.
744.200000 745.480000 We're told about that, right?
745.480000 750.640000 And about that we may experience conflict or persecution
750.640000 752.760000 or things like that.
752.760000 761.200000 Oh, when I said in the earlier days of my life,
761.200000 765.120000 I believe Jesus was God.
765.120000 768.560000 Somebody to be respected and listened to.
768.560000 773.480000 And I knew I could return out of my foolishness,
773.480000 777.200000 escape my foolishness, situation, whatever I said.
777.200000 780.600000 So I know it was truth.
780.600000 783.600000 But as I said earlier, I'd never anchored.
783.600000 792.200000 As we develop, our teenagers are adolescents.
792.200000 796.040000 The brain's not fully developed.
796.040000 803.200000 Maybe mine isn't fully developed yet, but we take risks.
803.200000 811.120000 You know, at that age and I just didn't 100% settled down
811.120000 819.760000 to anchor in for a daily, daily walk with Christ.
819.760000 823.960000 I grew up in the Presbyterian Church.
823.960000 827.960000 And that age and adolescents, you don't really
827.960000 832.080000 see the big picture of what's going on.
832.080000 836.080000 And I didn't see some Christian values
836.080000 838.440000 that I was looking for.
838.440000 843.920000 But that was my viewpoint, my limited understanding.
843.920000 846.800000 It's always important to me that people should walk the walk
846.800000 849.280000 that they talk, right?
849.280000 852.520000 I just didn't see it.
852.520000 858.480000 And so I did look for other faith traditions.
858.480000 864.560000 And the Quakers was one great, great people.
864.560000 876.520000 But in the, they kind of, as their faith developed over the years,
876.520000 877.440000 forgive me.
877.440000 883.680000 I'm not putting anybody down, but Jesus kind of got left behind
883.680000 886.720000 in their faith and practice.
886.720000 891.440000 And so moved on to that.
891.440000 894.240000 And then as we were in Potter County a few years,
894.240000 897.360000 we encountered the other people.
897.360000 899.680000 And that was the Mennonite Church.
899.680000 906.040000 And that's when things started to change
906.040000 910.040000 that we would, we should, we wanted
910.040000 918.800000 to anchor into Jesus as the rock and daily, daily.
918.800000 923.800000 Yeah, I think that it's interesting that different people
923.800000 928.400000 find a home within different faith traditions.
928.400000 931.000000 And I'm speaking generally here.
931.000000 933.680000 And I want to be clear, we are talking
933.680000 938.600000 about Bible believing true gospel.
938.600000 941.040000 God is the three, the three and one.
941.040000 944.920000 Jesus is the divine son of God and also God.
944.920000 947.240000 So there are some other religions out there
947.240000 951.720000 that are, or I would consider more of a cult that are not actually,
951.720000 953.120000 not actually truth.
953.120000 955.200000 But anyway, the ones that are in truth,
955.200000 958.280000 I think it's nice that there's a lot of different opportunities
958.280000 962.720000 for people to try things out and feel comfortable and find a home.
962.720000 965.320000 So anyway.
965.320000 967.640000 Well, and you're kind of speaking, Stephen,
967.640000 971.320000 to those times when, you know, maybe earlier in your life,
971.320000 973.960000 your faith wasn't anchored in that solid rock.
973.960000 981.880000 Daddy, can you talk a little bit about any examples from your life?
981.880000 984.520000 When did you see a difference in your life
984.520000 987.200000 being anchored in Christ versus not?
987.200000 990.960000 Well, that first experience is about joining the church.
990.960000 998.360000 And responding to the gospel when I was probably around 12 almost.
998.360000 1004.720000 And during the course of high school,
1004.720000 1007.520000 there was one time that there was this girl
1007.520000 1015.320000 who got our principal to agree to let us have a program in school
1015.320000 1019.480000 where she took the girls to the lunchroom, I took the guys to the gym.
1019.480000 1023.480000 And we basically had a gospel presentation
1023.480000 1027.640000 and gave them a chance to respond to it along with, you know,
1027.640000 1032.160000 singing a few songs and stuff like that.
1032.160000 1036.040000 And so I look back on that and say,
1036.040000 1041.480000 well, God was, I mean, why would I have a program in a school
1041.480000 1046.440000 to share the gospel if God hadn't done something in my life?
1046.440000 1052.840000 So I look back on that as some evidence of God working in my life
1052.840000 1059.040000 and of me knowing that Christ was the answer to our sin problem.
1059.040000 1066.640000 And I wanted other people to know about that and realize that God wanted me
1066.640000 1071.080000 and us to expand it to share that with other people.
1071.080000 1078.320000 So I'm not sure whether that particularly addresses the thing.
1078.320000 1081.520000 And I think the more the college experience would be the time
1081.520000 1091.120000 that more firmly committed to not only Christ is a solid rock in my faith,
1091.120000 1099.200000 but also to the Great Commission in obeying what he came to do to save the sinners
1099.200000 1103.560000 and what he told us to do to make disciples of all nations.
1103.560000 1110.800000 So that was, I think, probably the more broad-based foundation
1110.800000 1113.440000 that I found in the Lord.
1113.440000 1117.600000 I have been looking forward to asking this next question.
1117.600000 1123.360000 Did either of you ever build your life on something other than Christ?
1123.360000 1130.120000 And if so, what did you mistakenly put your trust in that wasn't solid rock?
1130.120000 1133.520000 Well, I'll speak up first.
1133.520000 1136.360000 So this again goes back to those years.
1136.360000 1140.960000 Now, remember, we grew up in the '60s
1140.960000 1146.600000 when there was great, cultural change, the hippie movement, free loves,
1146.600000 1155.640000 and a cry for teaching things that were relevant, and big business was bad.
1155.640000 1162.960000 And all that, and all these college campuses, especially where I lived or where I grew up,
1162.960000 1171.480000 there's a lot of that mistake and turmoil anyway, mistaken logic.
1171.480000 1175.200000 So I was affected by it because I was looking for what was real
1175.200000 1179.520000 and what was, you know, had good solid ethics
1179.520000 1183.800000 and being raised at the Christian home.
1183.800000 1192.160000 Well, groups that had, I say, Christian values or ethics.
1192.160000 1200.040000 And then also I worked at a drug rehab place, and so there was great emphasis
1200.040000 1206.560000 on understanding on psychology and counseling and psychiatry and all that.
1206.560000 1213.920000 And so, you know, I was involved in that stuff, but listen,
1213.920000 1220.720000 there's Christian ethics carried out by people, groups and organizations.
1220.720000 1226.120000 And then there's the words of Jesus Christ.
1226.120000 1232.280000 Christian ethics is going to take you, could take you anywhere.
1232.280000 1234.480000 We're supposed to be loving, we're supposed to be nice.
1234.480000 1238.520000 So we can excuse this, whatever.
1238.520000 1244.440000 No, the words of Christ is our guide.
1244.440000 1252.000000 So, yes, drug rehab place was okay.
1252.000000 1253.640000 It's not the answer.
1253.640000 1255.760000 Psychology is not the answer.
1255.760000 1257.080000 The ultimate answer for your life.
1257.080000 1260.080000 It's a tool people use.
1260.080000 1270.760000 And other faith traditions, if you don't teach and hear and live,
1270.760000 1277.320000 or attempt to live, the words of Christ, then it's false.
1277.320000 1279.560000 It's, it's false.
1279.560000 1287.920000 So, again, I said we found a community of believers at the Mennonite Church,
1287.920000 1294.520000 and it was great new for us, of course, at the same time some people found no value in it.
1294.520000 1298.800000 It's not, no denominations special and unique.
1298.800000 1302.000000 It's just our, how God calls us.
1302.000000 1308.560000 But we did find the words of Jesus to guide our life, the words of Jesus,
1308.560000 1310.800000 the teaching of Jesus.
1310.800000 1318.520000 And we understood all scripture is inspired by God,
1318.520000 1322.480000 but all scripture leads to Jesus.
1322.480000 1328.920000 All scripture, all testament leads to Jesus.
1328.920000 1335.160000 And then after the gospel, of course, how we should live for Jesus.
1335.160000 1348.280000 So, other groups, religious groups, or, and the other world, okay, but not the real thing.
1348.280000 1356.400000 So that's, that's where we, I anchored, anchored, anchored in the Christ as a rock.
1356.400000 1366.320000 Yeah, notice you, you referred to our and we, a couple of times there, Stephen, as, as you were sharing.
1366.320000 1379.680000 And I'll just share that my, my, my wife accepted Christ and, and began to trust him as her Lord during the time.
1379.680000 1383.640000 She was in college, which was, I was there at the same time.
1383.640000 1398.440000 And since then, if I get out of line too much, she'll remind me of what right thing is and it's helpful to listen.
1398.440000 1405.840000 When you got somebody that you know, to trust the Lord, and she even studies the Bible a lot.
1405.840000 1431.320000 So she knows probably more about it and I do, but going back to the, what I mistakenly put my faith in, there are a lot of things along the way that I really got tied up in it that, I mean, when I was in high school, football was the biggest thing to me and probably to a lot of the other guys that played too, but I thought that was, and I look back on this.
1431.320000 1449.320000 There are a lot of good lessons things to do and how to do it and things not, and not how to do it in football, but that was one thing, dating was another thing, you know, if you didn't have a date and something was wrong with you.
1449.320000 1457.320000 So I figured I need to have a date for whatever I was going to be doing and work pretty hard to make sure that that happened.
1457.320000 1474.320000 So, well, after that, you know, I went on to school, I got in the track of finishing college and going to med school and a lot of that was just oriented around that goal of finishing that track.
1474.320000 1486.320000 But after that, you know, being in business, making money that motivated me at some points, I don't think it meant that I didn't trust the Lord.
1486.320000 1505.320000 I didn't seek to know whether what things I was trying or what he wanted me to do, but it did sort of monopolize or at least emphasize certain things in my life that weren't necessarily biblical.
1505.320000 1520.320000 It's not that they were wrong, but they just weren't fulfilling the great commission, for example. And then later on after you, you know, I've never made a whole lot of money compared to what most doctors make.
1520.320000 1532.320000 But God did through what mom and dad had saved, got started on investing and saving in a retirement fund and all that kind of thing.
1532.320000 1544.320000 So I'd get, well, how much is there? How much is going to be there? Is there going to be enough there? What do you do with it when you finally realize it is there a little bit?
1544.320000 1561.320000 So that orientation was present. I mean, I was going along doing things that I thought God wanted me to do at the same time, but that was an emphasis that could have gotten me off track.
1561.320000 1574.320000 I don't think it ever got me completely off track, but those are some things that may have been competition to trust in Christ and everything.
1574.320000 1588.320000 Yeah, like the way you put that as competition because none of those things are bad things, they are actually good things, but so easily those are the things that can take the place of Christ being the focus in the center.
1588.320000 1592.320000 And it's not always a dramatic, not as a dramatic thing.
1592.320000 1602.320000 Right. We've talked in our last episode about how when you have a building, it needs to be anchored to the foundation to the rock to the soil underneath it.
1602.320000 1609.320000 And if it's not properly anchored, different forces like seismic activity or whatever can move it off of the foundation.
1609.320000 1621.320000 And I thought that was, of course, that was information that you gave me daddy. But I thought that that was a really interesting, interesting sort of parallel to these discussions we're having.
1621.320000 1635.320000 Like you said, Hutch, you accepted Christ, you had the program in school, you know, all these things, but even even though you'd built your whole family structure in your life on this rock, sometimes things come along, forced to sort of move us off of that.
1635.320000 1658.320000 And Mary Beth and I have talked in the past about the different idols that we raise up the false idols that we raise up and but, sorry, sounds like I'm giving you like a talking to, but the point I'm trying to make is that it's so easy for these things to turn our eyes off of Jesus and in our affection.
1658.320000 1664.320000 Yeah. So this is great guys. I'm really enjoying this.
1664.320000 1685.320000 I like hearing what Hutch said and it wasn't like we were praying to Ouija boards or going to Buddhist monasteries and it wasn't that the business, the same for retirement.
1685.320000 1694.320000 Well, business schedule, you know what you're all that stuff can overtake us, it can overtake us.
1694.320000 1695.320000 Yeah.
1695.320000 1714.320000 And they're good things, but I praise God for obviously for my wife and then, you know, to have Bible study group and have Sunday morning church, the fellowship, the kind of encouragement on another.
1714.320000 1726.320000 And, you know, it's kind of subtly iron sharpening iron, you know what I'm saying, as the Bible says so.
1726.320000 1739.320000 And we are always put not only a priority, we just decided this is what what it was going to be for our families that we always went to church on Sunday.
1739.320000 1749.320000 And so there never was a real debate about that. I mean, we committed to that right from the start when we got married and I was already doing it before we got married.
1749.320000 1761.320000 It might have been times if I'd, you know, based it on how I was feeling out of slept in or something, but whenever the church had a service, we were pretty much there.
1761.320000 1775.320000 And that's the way the children grew up to so they at least saw that pattern and were involved in it as they were going up, which I think has had an effect on them too, obviously.
1775.320000 1782.320000 Well, definitely, and that does lead into kind of this next question about our families.
1782.320000 1795.320000 How have you seen our family's life flourish because of this decision to build our family on crisis the rock? Daddy, I'll go back to you first for that one.
1795.320000 1806.320000 Well, sort of just to continue what I was just saying that all three of our children are believers and involved in ministry and one way or the other.
1806.320000 1817.320000 And so that's a real blessing to us. There's, I don't know, remember what the verse is, but there's a verse about there's nothing better than having your children following along after the Lord.
1817.320000 1832.320000 And it is a blessing to see that God has been faithful in each of their lives, flourishing as a couple, I think that we've had different ministry opportunities that we've been involved in.
1832.320000 1846.320000 We just restarted a practice we had in Augusta for about 10 years of having some couples groups that come to study communication and marriage and how to love.
1846.320000 1861.320000 Wives and respect husbands and I'm particularly really glad we're doing that again because I believe you'll respond to the gospel not just hear and intellectually believe it.
1861.320000 1874.320000 So it that's been the first thing that actively I've been involved in on a ongoing way since we move to make it here.
1874.320000 1888.320000 Well, and I'll chime in as the child in this family. Can I answer this question? Yes, yes, I'll let you Mary Beth. How have you seen your own life flourish because your father chose to base his life on Jesus?
1888.320000 1909.320000 I mean, what he said is true about kind of anytime the church doors were open, we were there and there's a lot of growth and benefit that came from that, you know, talk about laying the foundation of knowing the word and being taught and being in fellowship with other believers and how, you know, crucial that is as part of life.
1909.320000 1923.320000 I think it also provided as a child growing up a sense of purpose and security for our family. There was never a question in my mind about where my family stood on things.
1923.320000 1936.320000 And essentially as a teenager you know, your friends are into different things and questioning different things. It's where my faith was becoming my own as a teenager, but there was that.
1936.320000 1952.320000 I mean, safety nets not the right word. There was that real living breathing thing in our family that Christ is who he says he is and not only this intellectual knowledge, but he is in and among our family.
1952.320000 1979.320000 He's moving, he is working, all those things were true. And so for that to be the basis, you know, that I launched out into the world as an adult, I'm not knowing what the heck I wanted to do with my life was very was very crucial to, you know, my faith remaining steady and, you know, fast forword to today, you know, we're raising up the next generation of believers, hopefully in our family.
1979.320000 1994.320000 So, well, what about you, Stephen? What would you say? How have you seen your family's life flourish because you decided to build your family on Christ as the rock?
1994.320000 2020.320000 Well, it took many, many years for me to really get a full grasp of what my family, my mom and dad were and what they'd committed to at a young age, because I heard when I was still in my 60s, I heard some stories from the last surviving aunt about what.
2020.320000 2038.320000 What the beginnings were for my father was born. So I always knew we went to church, I always knew Jesus and my parents lived faithful Christian lives.
2038.320000 2049.320000 But again, for me, Jesus was the rock I went back to when I got myself in trouble. If you know what I mean, you know what I mean.
2049.320000 2056.320000 So I said that was, but I want to read your verse from Isaiah.
2056.320000 2067.320000 Listen to me, you who pursue righteousness and seek the Lord, look to the rock from which you were cut and to the quarry from which you were healed.
2067.320000 2096.320000 So in this case, I'm going to refer to family or an even family generations before biological family, as much said, as Mary Beth said, you set the pattern, you set the tone of faithfully following Christ, even when we didn't understand everything.
2096.320000 2101.320000 Even when they were a little tired, you know.
2101.320000 2109.320000 So that was good. That was good. I'm thankful for my family, my mom and dad.
2109.320000 2119.320000 I'm thankful that my wife and I committed the same path of living an active Christian life.
2119.320000 2127.320000 I want to talk about our Heavenly Father or God's family.
2127.320000 2132.320000 There's times in my life when God without.
2132.320000 2135.320000 Well, he just intervened.
2135.320000 2140.320000 I mean, he saved me from stuff like.
2140.320000 2153.320000 And I see God's hand at work when like serious, like really, really serious illnesses.
2153.320000 2160.320000 And God showing up to care for and preserve.
2160.320000 2170.320000 Well, yes, family big, big issue. It's important to us, but I mourn. I mourn.
2170.320000 2178.320000 Or those that don't have that family foundation background.
2178.320000 2189.320000 And these are some of the people we have to encourage and give support to.
2189.320000 2197.320000 I was also thinking about that too, Dad, when we were preparing for this interview.
2197.320000 2204.320000 Mary Beth and I have had privileges, not a strong enough word.
2204.320000 2211.320000 Blessing gift, boon, grace. I can't even to have the family background that we have had.
2211.320000 2217.320000 Just still have both of our parents with us.
2217.320000 2223.320000 And the fact too that both of you, well, you know, Hutch, I've only known you for half an hour now.
2223.320000 2230.320000 I zoomed call, but like through Mary Beth, but that both of you are exemplary men.
2230.320000 2237.320000 And I certainly know that I've based a lot of my.
2237.320000 2240.320000 Yeah, you were good examples.
2240.320000 2244.320000 So I mean, it's just like Dad said, I mourn for those that didn't have this.
2244.320000 2249.320000 And yeah, there's so much hurt and brokenness.
2249.320000 2254.320000 But I do want to say that it's sort of an answer to the question as well as a child of the family.
2254.320000 2261.320000 I certainly went my own way in my later teen and early adult years.
2261.320000 2264.320000 And I thought that I knew the best way to make decisions.
2264.320000 2267.320000 But I had something to leave.
2267.320000 2270.320000 I had something to push against.
2270.320000 2279.320000 I had a framework that I could step away from, but then knew 100% what I was coming back to, you know.
2279.320000 2289.320000 And I think that in this world of moral relativity and well, everything's relative anymore.
2289.320000 2297.320000 We have to have solid firm understanding of truth.
2297.320000 2302.320000 Well, that's such a good reminder Sarah that it's really easy.
2302.320000 2305.320000 Now raising children.
2305.320000 2309.320000 To just kind of go with that, that's fine for them.
2309.320000 2312.320000 This is what we're doing.
2312.320000 2315.320000 There's that gray area of.
2315.320000 2317.320000 We know what is true.
2317.320000 2322.320000 And we know that things are right or wrong, good or evil of the Lord or not.
2322.320000 2328.320000 But at the same time, we are called to love the people around us where they are, right?
2328.320000 2339.320000 And so it's that I feel like this is the challenge of raising a family in 2026 is.
2339.320000 2344.320000 It's not just, oh, this is what our family believes it's this is true.
2344.320000 2345.320000 Right.
2345.320000 2351.320000 And there is truth and there are lies and making that distinction in love to the people around us.
2351.320000 2354.320000 I think is exceptionally challenging right now.
2354.320000 2360.320000 And I think for me, one of the areas that has been to try to call out sin.
2360.320000 2367.320000 Like not in a, not in a hurtful or unkind way, but calling out sin.
2367.320000 2374.320000 And even in my own life, to my child, to my son saying, ooh, I did this not, not okay.
2393.320000 2397.320000 Oh, this has been a great conversation so far.
2397.320000 2400.320000 Let's say we're rapidly running out of time.
2400.320000 2406.320000 When we were thinking about this podcast episode, the him, the solid rock came to mind.
2406.320000 2410.320000 And I believe you're both familiar with that on Christ, the solid rock.
2410.320000 2413.320000 I stand all other ground to sinking sand.
2413.320000 2416.320000 I'm going to read a stanza of the him.
2416.320000 2419.320000 And then I'm going to ask you a question.
2419.320000 2423.320000 When darkness veils his lovely face.
2423.320000 2428.320000 I rest on his unchanging grace.
2428.320000 2436.320000 In every high and stormy gale, my anchor holds within the veil.
2436.320000 2440.320000 Here's the question.
2440.320000 2450.320000 Tell us about a time in your life when darkness veiled the face of Christ or when you experienced a high and stormy gale.
2450.320000 2455.320000 How did Christ as your rock help you through that situation?
2455.320000 2461.320000 I'll start if you like the.
2461.320000 2465.320000 Maybe I should let Stephen start.
2465.320000 2471.320000 This is a special song to me.
2471.320000 2475.320000 And.
2475.320000 2480.320000 When darkness veils his lovely face.
2480.320000 2493.320000 I don't remember anytime ever that the darkness veiled Christ's lovely face.
2493.320000 2501.320000 Even when I do things I knew I shouldn't be doing and did not do things I should be doing.
2501.320000 2511.320000 I never had any question about who Christ was and what he had done for me and what God's intention and him coming to earth was.
2511.320000 2514.320000 So that part of it, I never had. 
2514.320000 2521.320000  As a challenge in every high and stormy gale.
2521.320000 2532.320000 My anchor holds within the veil. I think most of my challenge is that that required trusting God or career things.
2532.320000 2547.320000 I started off doing primary care practice, which I enjoyed and yet because I got off into other things like politics and trying to make money and that kind of stuff.
2547.320000 2558.320000 Transitioned into doing emergency medicine and the way he are staffing generally works in smaller hospitals at least where I work.
2558.320000 2566.320000 It is there's a third party company that hired you as an independent contractor and you feel shifts.
2566.320000 2576.320000 And so they put you on the schedule and you work well that's the very tenuous position and particularly if you tend to.
2576.320000 2594.320000 Say what you think then that can get you in trouble and and there were several times that what you want to call it getting fired and taking off the schedule they never would say they're firing they say well they don't want us to schedule you anymore.
2594.320000 2610.320000 Well, I said you'd have to go somewhere. I'd have to go somewhere else and you know you got a family at home that you're paying for the food and their clothing and.
2610.320000 2627.320000 Schooling while they were going to high school and you need money to do that so it puts you at a place where you don't have the way that you've been making money to do that.
2627.320000 2648.320000 So you get you know you get to sick feeling in your stomach and not that settles right there and and those are the times I guess maybe they were good because that's when I'd get more serious about praying and talking to God about what he intended.
2648.320000 2667.320000 And even the other than the other experiences having to change hospitals where I work and that kind of thing I tried to transition to some other career things for real state insurance and all sorts of stuff and I ran for office one time so.
2667.320000 2690.320000 There was a question if you remember a specific time we experienced reality of Christ as a solid rock in your life and I would say that those challenges of stormy gales also illustrated a time when the reality of Christ worked out as the reality of Christ and Jesus never failed.
2690.320000 2702.320000 He always provided what we needed and we never suffered from a lack of anything that was.
2702.320000 2713.320000 You know we probably didn't spend as much money some people but we had plenty and we had food to eat, jobs to work hard, right in schools go to all that kind of thing and.
2713.320000 2725.320000 He never failed even when even when I'd have a sinking thing in the pit of my stomach and what are we going to do, well he always provided something to do.
2725.320000 2733.320000 Thank you for sharing that well that connects.
2733.320000 2737.320000 That connects with me.
2737.320000 2745.320000 I have a question for you Hutch, did you ever take fish hooks out of people's hands or bellies or shoulders.
2745.320000 2757.320000 He or Dr so there I believe I'm next about this darkness yes.
2757.320000 2771.320000 There there were times when things were very very very dark and unpredictable and I'm not going to go into the details.
2771.320000 2785.320000 But I could know like from Psalm 139 verse 11 if I say surely the darkness will hide me in the light become night around me.
2785.320000 2797.320000 Even the darkness will not be dark to you God the night will shine like the day for darkness is as light to you.
2797.320000 2801.320000 Like I may not have felt it.
2801.320000 2810.320000 I may not have seen it but I could pray that and I could take assurance in that Bible verse I could I could.
2810.320000 2816.320000 Live on it I could survive by it I knew.
2816.320000 2821.320000 God was present even though I didn't feel like it.
2821.320000 2825.320000 If that makes sense.
2825.320000 2828.320000 It really does.
2828.320000 2842.320000 God is beyond our understanding yet he's given us enough to know his grace and mercy through his son Jesus Christ our Lord.
2842.320000 2848.320000 So yeah that's my comment on darkness.
2848.320000 2857.320000 I love that verse and I studying first John right now and yeah beginning it you know he talks a lot about darkness and light and.
2857.320000 2869.320000 Just you know how Jesus is light it's just yeah I love that verse from Psalm 139 well any other closing thoughts from either one of our guests or you Mary Beth.
2869.320000 2880.320000 I did want my dad to share I think I mentioned this in the last episode or mentioned it maybe in many episodes this phrase hold to the rock has been something my dad has told my family.
2880.320000 2884.320000 At least since I was a teenager probably my whole life I just don't remember.
2884.320000 2891.320000 So it's been a phrase that if you're if you ask me what's something your dad says all the time this would be one of those things hold to the rock.
2891.320000 2898.320000 So I would love for him to share the quick story of where that came from in his life.
2898.320000 2913.320000 Well the way that it got into the hands of my children were I sort of typed up some verses that illustrated that one of which Stephen just shared.
2913.320000 2927.320000 But it came from a friend of mine who he ultimately became a lifelong missionary still is at our age still working and his family had a lady that helped him at home with.
2927.320000 2942.320000 Work at home cleaning and cooking and whatever else need to be doing around the home and and every time my friend would be at home and leave to go back to school or later in life to go back to his missionary work.
2942.320000 2960.320000 She would tell him as he as he left to go up the driveway said hold to the rock and he shared that with me and it sort of stuck since that time since the first time he told me about it and I.
2960.320000 2975.320000 I like it because it reminds me of the eternal truth of our rock we've been talking about and because of the wisdom and love of those who know the rock firsthand from their own experience and want others to remember him as well.
2975.320000 2989.320000 And so I use it as a closing for correspondence or response to emails or posts on Facebook and all sorts of things it's just sort of something I can say rather than thinking about you.
2989.320000 3001.320000 I just say hold the rock and the last question you all had on your list was closing thoughts which I guess this is what we're talking about.
3001.320000 3016.320000 And so my closing thoughts not only for me and you all but for anybody that you come in contact with that you would encourage them that always.
3016.320000 3035.320000 Excuse me in every place in every circumstance and every time with everyone hold to the rock.
3035.320000 3057.320000 Amen. Thank you. Thank you to all three of you. This has been a very special time that we've had and I know that I will have a treasure it likewise.
3057.320000 3067.320000 But this may be the in the edit section by Mary Beth. That that part was coming sooner or later.
3067.320000 3073.320000 Good to put it at the end. Yeah.
3073.320000 3079.320000 Uh, no, dad. Did you have any final thing you want to say?
3079.320000 3090.320000 Yes. Hutch. Do I have permission to use that phrase hold to the rock when I talk to people or encourage them.
3090.320000 3097.320000 Certainly. Thank you so much. I encourage you to do it. Yeah.
3097.320000 3122.320000 I'm Sarah. I'm Mary Beth. I'm Stephen. And I'm Hutch. And this is trustworthy. Hold to the rock.
3122.320000 3132.320000 Hey y'all Mary Beth here. Sarah and I are so glad that you chose to listen to our podcast. And while we think that we're awesome friends to have.
3132.320000 3141.244625 We just wanted to clarify that we are not mental health professionals and want you to know that this podcast should not take the place of any paid professional advice.